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How dark and different was Jurassic World in your opinion
#11
(12-26-2016, 03:18 PM)Dr. Wu Wrote: It did had slight gore and Jack. When Indominous ate the fat guard we saw good amount of blood in it's mouth, during the Indominous ambush of the ACU we saw people get killed pretty violently, and Zara's death. And the kids were terrified when running for their lives.
For me that's a reason to call the film dark. IMO it's way darker than JP and JP3. TLW however does have good amount of blood and violent deaths plus having a ominous tone.

(12-23-2016, 06:11 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote:
(12-22-2016, 03:45 PM)Jack Wrote: I didn't think JW was dark at all. There was never a sense of true isolation or terror. The kids just found everything cool and fun.

Mmmmm, what? Not to sound rude, but I honestly don't get what you're trying to say other than making an underhanded insult. They were absolutely terrified numerous times in the film.

I don't think Jack was insulting you, he was just stating his opinion.

On the thread topic, I didn't find JW "terrifying" but I will say I find the film darker than JP and JP3.
I didn't mean to say he was insulting me personally, but the film.

(12-30-2016, 08:17 AM)Aegyptiacus3 Wrote:
(12-28-2016, 07:01 PM)Dr. Wu Wrote: I disagree, the characters defiantly experience 'terror' in JW because to me when a dinosaur eats someone that's 'terror'.

Okay seriously, I didn't find JW to be 'lighthearted' at all. Yes the film was more 'shiny' than the other films but the kills to me were more brutal. To me the moment the first person died the sh*t got real in JW.

Ehhh... The only scenes where it did feel 'terrifying' was the Raptor ambush and the I.rex ACU attack. Everything else felt pretty tame to be honest. The dialogue and abrupt scene changes take some of the tension away. 

I disagree that the kills were more brutal. People forget how brutal the first movie was... Dennis getting spat on and mauled to death, Ray getting his arm ripped off (and presumably devoured), Gennaro getting chomped, Muldoon getting mauled and ripped apart. JW on the other hand wa MUCH tamer, the only thing that felt remotely brutal was the ACU soldiers getting picked off. TLW is even more brutal than JP, and at least in JP3 the film gets darker and darker as it goes along. JW was actually pretty tame, it had to be. Couldn't be too violent.

Some of these things aren't really comparable. Nedry's death never came off as brutal to me. But that's more entirely subjective. Not to mention it happens off-screen. Ray's arm also happened off-screen. A bloody stump isn't what I would call brutal persay, merely a shock. Gennaro's death was brutal, as was Muldoons. 

I'd say the ACU attack alone was more brutal than anything in the first film. The chaos depicted in the sound design (screaming, score, I-Rex sounds) and directing in that scene was pretty intense. It has a visceral feeling to it because of the in your face execution. Also, Zara's death is a no brainer. The raptor attack at night. I also found Hoskins death the be pretty brutal too. 

So I would have to utterly disagree JW lacks tension, fear and brutality. I'd say it's actually matches TLW on that scale, maybe even surpasses it.
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#12
(12-30-2016, 08:17 AM)Aegyptiacus3 Wrote: Ehhh... The only scenes where it did feel 'terrifying' was the Raptor ambush and the I.rex ACU attack. Everything else felt pretty tame to be honest. The dialogue and abrupt scene changes take some of the tension away. 

I disagree that the kills were more brutal. People forget how brutal the first movie was... Dennis getting spat on and mauled to death, Ray getting his arm ripped off (and presumably devoured), Gennaro getting chomped, Muldoon getting mauled and ripped apart. JW on the other hand wa MUCH tamer, the only thing that felt remotely brutal was the ACU soldiers getting picked off. TLW is even more brutal than JP, and at least in JP3 the film gets darker and darker as it goes along. JW was actually pretty tame, it had to be. Couldn't be too violent.

I don't find the film 'terrifying' but IMO it did have more brutal deaths. Anyone forgetting Zara?

Go to the tvtropes.org page for JW, the film is listed as 'Darker and Edgier' than JP & JP3 and I 100% agree. JP3 is listed as 'Lighter and Softer'

I can see arguments of TLW being darker due to Eddie's death but JP3 being darker than JW LOL.

(01-01-2017, 04:55 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: Some of these things aren't really comparable. Nedry's death never came off as brutal to me. But that's more entirely subjective. Not to mention it happens off-screen. Ray's arm also happened off-screen. A bloody stump isn't what I would call brutal persay, merely a shock. Gennaro's death was brutal, as was Muldoons. 

I'd say the ACU attack alone was more brutal than anything in the first film. The chaos depicted in the sound design (screaming, score, I-Rex sounds) and directing in that scene was pretty intense. It has a visceral feeling to it because of the in your face execution. Also, Zara's death is a no brainer. The raptor attack at night. I also found Hoskins death the be pretty brutal too. 

So I would have to utterly disagree JW lacks tension, fear and brutality. I'd say it's actually matches TLW on that scale, maybe even surpasses it.

I completely agree. JW and TLW had the most brutal deaths. It's hard to determine which were more graphic.
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#13
(01-03-2017, 03:47 AM)Dr. Wu Wrote:
(12-30-2016, 08:17 AM)Aegyptiacus3 Wrote: Ehhh... The only scenes where it did feel 'terrifying' was the Raptor ambush and the I.rex ACU attack. Everything else felt pretty tame to be honest. The dialogue and abrupt scene changes take some of the tension away. 

I disagree that the kills were more brutal. People forget how brutal the first movie was... Dennis getting spat on and mauled to death, Ray getting his arm ripped off (and presumably devoured), Gennaro getting chomped, Muldoon getting mauled and ripped apart. JW on the other hand wa MUCH tamer, the only thing that felt remotely brutal was the ACU soldiers getting picked off. TLW is even more brutal than JP, and at least in JP3 the film gets darker and darker as it goes along. JW was actually pretty tame, it had to be. Couldn't be too violent.

I don't find the film 'terrifying' but IMO it did have more brutal deaths. Anyone forgetting Zara?

Go to the tvtropes.org page for JW, the film is listed as 'Darker and Edgier' than JP & JP3 and I 100% agree. JP3 is listed as 'Lighter and Softer'

I can see arguments of TLW being darker due to Eddie's death but JP3 being darker than JW LOL.

(01-01-2017, 04:55 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: Some of these things aren't really comparable. Nedry's death never came off as brutal to me. But that's more entirely subjective. Not to mention it happens off-screen. Ray's arm also happened off-screen. A bloody stump isn't what I would call brutal persay, merely a shock. Gennaro's death was brutal, as was Muldoons. 

I'd say the ACU attack alone was more brutal than anything in the first film. The chaos depicted in the sound design (screaming, score, I-Rex sounds) and directing in that scene was pretty intense. It has a visceral feeling to it because of the in your face execution. Also, Zara's death is a no brainer. The raptor attack at night. I also found Hoskins death the be pretty brutal too. 

So I would have to utterly disagree JW lacks tension, fear and brutality. I'd say it's actually matches TLW on that scale, maybe even surpasses it.

I completely agree. JW and TLW had the most brutal deaths. It's hard to determine which were more graphic.


Yeah, I think people conflate actual darkness with violence. TLW is definitely the most visually dark film of the series. But I honestly don't think it's all that much more brutal or violent than the first film. I just re-watched it again and the only scenes that I felt were particularly brutal were Eddie's death and Dieter's death. When I think about it more and more, JP and JW are the most vicious films by far. The opening raptor attack in JP is brutal without even seeing anything. We have Gennaro's death and Muldoon's death. All of these scenes pack the most punch to me. 

JW actually has the most scenes where you go "Ohhh! Ahhh! Jeez!" 

The death of the I-Rex guard, the ACU attack, Zara's death, the guy getting impaled by the Pterodon beak, the entire Raptor sequence and the big fight at the end, even though it's between animals...it's pretty brutal. 

So like I said, now that I think about it scene by scene...JW is actually the most brutal and violent to me.
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#14
(01-03-2017, 08:57 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote:
(01-03-2017, 03:47 AM)Dr. Wu Wrote: I don't find the film 'terrifying' but IMO it did have more brutal deaths. Anyone forgetting Zara?

Go to the tvtropes.org page for JW, the film is listed as 'Darker and Edgier' than JP & JP3 and I 100% agree. JP3 is listed as 'Lighter and Softer'

I can see arguments of TLW being darker due to Eddie's death but JP3 being darker than JW LOL.

(01-01-2017, 04:55 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: Some of these things aren't really comparable. Nedry's death never came off as brutal to me. But that's more entirely subjective. Not to mention it happens off-screen. Ray's arm also happened off-screen. A bloody stump isn't what I would call brutal persay, merely a shock. Gennaro's death was brutal, as was Muldoons. 

I'd say the ACU attack alone was more brutal than anything in the first film. The chaos depicted in the sound design (screaming, score, I-Rex sounds) and directing in that scene was pretty intense. It has a visceral feeling to it because of the in your face execution. Also, Zara's death is a no brainer. The raptor attack at night. I also found Hoskins death the be pretty brutal too. 

So I would have to utterly disagree JW lacks tension, fear and brutality. I'd say it's actually matches TLW on that scale, maybe even surpasses it.

I completely agree. JW and TLW had the most brutal deaths. It's hard to determine which were more graphic.


Yeah, I think people conflate actual darkness with violence. TLW is definitely the most visually dark film of the series. But I honestly don't think it's all that much more brutal or violent than the first film. I just re-watched it again and the only scenes that I felt were particularly brutal were Eddie's death and Dieter's death. When I think about it more and more, JP and JW are the most vicious films by far. The opening raptor attack in JP is brutal without even seeing anything. We have Gennaro's death and Muldoon's death. All of these scenes pack the most punch to me. 

JW actually has the most scenes where you go "Ohhh! Ahhh! Jeez!" 

The death of the I-Rex guard, the ACU attack, Zara's death, the guy getting impaled by the Pterodon beak, the entire Raptor sequence and the big fight at the end, even though it's between animals...it's pretty brutal. 

So like I said, now that I think about it scene by scene...JW is actually the most brutal and violent to me.

Well...

The Indominus eating Nick (the fat park worker) was less gory than Gennaro's death. You only saw him get chomped. 
As for Ellis (the 1st worker killed) again, less gory than Gennaro's death, IMO.
As for the ACU attack, only 3 were killed by the Indominus (1 squashed, 2 chomped) and are mostly obscured.
The kids didn't feel as terrified or as believable as Tim and Lex IMO.
JP3 has the feeling of isolation, the group is by themselves completely defenceless. In JW, you get none of this. It just feels tame and everything is too light and brightly contrasted.

Nedry's death is pretty brutal. When you compare how it is similarly described in the book and how he was literally mauled and gutted, you'd know it was pretty terrifying. Same with Ray's death.
As for it happening off screen, there are a lot of deaths that happen off screen, but that doesn't make it less scary. If anything it ADDS terror. A good example of this is 'Alien'.
The ACU attack didn't feel that scary/brutal, it relied more on action than scare/horror IMO.
Zara's death could have been worse, but yes, a bit brutal.
The Pteranodon impaling the pilot was actually comical IMO. It felt completely out of left field.
Hoskins' death happens off-screen, so therefore it isn't brutal right? Tongue (and IMO Muldoon's death was much scarier) 
The raptor ambush is probably the darkest the film ever got IMO
The final fight was just as brutal as the JP3 Spino and Rex fight.
JW definitely has tension, I never said it didn't, but it just felt tame IMO. 

If you consider the tone and atmosphere of the 4 films, TLW has a constant sense of dread. JP and JP3 gets darker and darker. JW alternates between contrasting scenes. Tension is gone when we cut from scenes like the ACU about to find the I-rex (tense) to the boys on the monorail (tension lost). At least with the original 3, the entire team is in jeopardy in every scene.

JUST TO CLARIFY: I'm not shitting on the movie, but IMO it was the most tame and laid-back. It was a 'SOFT REBOOT after-all (emphasis on soft) Tongue
"It's a high hide. A high hide, you know you go up and you hide high. Goes up to where the trees are, and keeps the researchers out of harms way" - Eddie Carr
'Actually it would put them at a very convenient biting height" - Ian Malcolm
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#15
Aegyptiacus3
(01-03-2017, 08:57 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote:
(01-03-2017, 03:47 AM)Dr. Wu Wrote:
(01-01-2017, 04:55 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: Some of these things aren't really comparable. Nedry's death never came off as brutal to me. But that's more entirely subjective. Not to mention it happens off-screen. Ray's arm also happened off-screen. A bloody stump isn't what I would call brutal persay, merely a shock. Gennaro's death was brutal, as was Muldoons. 

I'd say the ACU attack alone was more brutal than anything in the first film. The chaos depicted in the sound design (screaming, score, I-Rex sounds) and directing in that scene was pretty intense. It has a visceral feeling to it because of the in your face execution. Also, Zara's death is a no brainer. The raptor attack at night. I also found Hoskins death the be pretty brutal too. 

So I would have to utterly disagree JW lacks tension, fear and brutality. I'd say it's actually matches TLW on that scale, maybe even surpasses it.

I completely agree. JW and TLW had the most brutal deaths. It's hard to determine which were more graphic.


Yeah, I think people conflate actual darkness with violence. TLW is definitely the most visually dark film of the series. But I honestly don't think it's all that much more brutal or violent than the first film. I just re-watched it again and the only scenes that I felt were particularly brutal were Eddie's death and Dieter's death. When I think about it more and more, JP and JW are the most vicious films by far. The opening raptor attack in JP is brutal without even seeing anything. We have Gennaro's death and Muldoon's death. All of these scenes pack the most punch to me. 

JW actually has the most scenes where you go "Ohhh! Ahhh! Jeez!" 

The death of the I-Rex guard, the ACU attack, Zara's death, the guy getting impaled by the Pterodon beak, the entire Raptor sequence and the big fight at the end, even though it's between animals...it's pretty brutal. 

So like I said, now that I think about it scene by scene...JW is actually the most brutal and violent to me.

Well...

The Indominus eating Nick (the fat park worker) was less gory than Gennaro's death. You only saw him get chomped. 
As for Ellis (the 1st worker killed) again, less gory than Gennaro's death, IMO.
As for the ACU attack, only 3 were killed by the Indominus (1 squashed, 2 chomped) and are mostly obscured.
The kids didn't feel as terrified or as believable as Tim and Lex IMO.
JP3 has the feeling of isolation, the group is by themselves completely defenceless. In JW, you get none of this. It just feels tame and everything is too light and brightly contrasted.

Nedry's death is pretty brutal. When you compare how it is similarly described in the book and how he was literally mauled and gutted, you'd know it was pretty terrifying. Same with Ray's death.
As for it happening off screen, there are a lot of deaths that happen off screen, but that doesn't make it less scary. If anything it ADDS terror. A good example of this is 'Alien'.
The ACU attack didn't feel that scary/brutal, it relied more on action than scare/horror IMO.
Zara's death could have been worse, but yes, a bit brutal.
The Pteranodon impaling the pilot was actually comical IMO. It felt completely out of left field.
Hoskins' death happens off-screen, so therefore it isn't brutal right? Tongue (and IMO Muldoon's death was much scarier) 
The raptor ambush is probably the darkest the film ever got IMO
The final fight was just as brutal as the JP3 Spino and Rex fight.
JW definitely has tension, I never said it didn't, but it just felt tame IMO. 

If you consider the tone and atmosphere of the 4 films, TLW has a constant sense of dread. JP and JP3 gets darker and darker. JW alternates between contrasting scenes. Tension is gone when we cut from scenes like the ACU about to find the I-rex (tense) to the boys on the monorail (tension lost). At least with the original 3, the entire team is in jeopardy in every scene.

JUST TO CLARIFY: I'm not shitting on the movie, but IMO it was the most tame and laid-back. It was a 'SOFT REBOOT after-all (emphasis on soft) Tongue

It all really comes down to how one feels invested in the film. For me, JP carries absolutely zero thrills, scares or suspense because I don't care about a thing going on. So none of the set piece have any bite (no pun intended) to them.

For JW, I liked the characters, I liked the story and that coupled with how I feel the set pieces were executed made for a far more violent feeling and suspenseful film. Gore doesn't automatically make something more or less brutal or impactful, but it depends on the scene. The death of the fat guard for example may not have been as prolonged or violent in execution as Gennaro's death...but the build up to it is what made it more brutal to me. Gennaro is presented as the downer. The party-pooper, money hungry lawyer. So his cowardice and fear make us want to see him bite the bullet. The fat guard was just a simple victim. Seeing him frightened to death, kissing his necklace, the look of "Oh sh!t, I'm done for" right before he gets chomped...all that adds to the impact of a death.

The same goes for Nedry. We don't like Nedry. He's a cry-baby backstabber. So when he gets his, it's more a comeuppance death than a death we're supposed to wince and squirm at. 

This is inverted with Deiter in TLW though because despite him being possibly the most one-note villain of the series, his prolonged death made the audience really get the chance to imagine themselves in that situation.
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#16
(01-06-2017, 07:39 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: It all really comes down to how one feels invested in the film. For me, JP carries absolutely zero thrills, scares or suspense because I don't care about a thing going on. So none of the set piece have any bite (no pun intended) to them.

For JW, I liked the characters, I liked the story and that coupled with how I feel the set pieces were executed made for a far more violent feeling and suspenseful film. Gore doesn't automatically make something more or less brutal or impactful, but it depends on the scene. The death of the fat guard for example may not have been as prolonged or violent in execution as Gennaro's death...but the build up to it is what made it more brutal to me. Gennaro is presented as the downer. The party-pooper, money hungry lawyer. So his cowardice and fear make us want to see him bite the bullet. The fat guard was just a simple victim. Seeing him frightened to death, kissing his necklace, the look of "Oh sh!t, I'm done for" right before he gets chomped...all that adds to the impact of a death.

The same goes for Nedry. We don't like Nedry. He's a cry-baby backstabber. So when he gets his, it's more a comeuppance death than a death we're supposed to wince and squirm at. 

This is inverted with Deiter in TLW though because despite him being possibly the most one-note villain of the series, his prolonged death made the audience really get the chance to imagine themselves in that situation.

You don't care about anything in JP... What? (You mean JP3 right?)
The fat guard (Nick) clearly didn't do his job, so I wanted to see him bite the dust  Tongue
If you read the book you'd understand Nedry's motivations for his actions. He was bullied and shoved by Hammond, he was forced to work overtime on the computers. Of course anyone would feel resentment and a bit revengeful for that.
And I don't know about you but I never wished for any JP character to die... They were each important/unique in their own way. There's no TRUE evil/bad guy in the JP movies. All of them have motivation and reasoning for their actions.
"It's a high hide. A high hide, you know you go up and you hide high. Goes up to where the trees are, and keeps the researchers out of harms way" - Eddie Carr
'Actually it would put them at a very convenient biting height" - Ian Malcolm
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#17
(01-07-2017, 11:33 PM)Aegyptiacus3 Wrote:
(01-06-2017, 07:39 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: It all really comes down to how one feels invested in the film. For me, JP carries absolutely zero thrills, scares or suspense because I don't care about a thing going on. So none of the set piece have any bite (no pun intended) to them.

For JW, I liked the characters, I liked the story and that coupled with how I feel the set pieces were executed made for a far more violent feeling and suspenseful film. Gore doesn't automatically make something more or less brutal or impactful, but it depends on the scene. The death of the fat guard for example may not have been as prolonged or violent in execution as Gennaro's death...but the build up to it is what made it more brutal to me. Gennaro is presented as the downer. The party-pooper, money hungry lawyer. So his cowardice and fear make us want to see him bite the bullet. The fat guard was just a simple victim. Seeing him frightened to death, kissing his necklace, the look of "Oh sh!t, I'm done for" right before he gets chomped...all that adds to the impact of a death.

The same goes for Nedry. We don't like Nedry. He's a cry-baby backstabber. So when he gets his, it's more a comeuppance death than a death we're supposed to wince and squirm at. 

This is inverted with Deiter in TLW though because despite him being possibly the most one-note villain of the series, his prolonged death made the audience really get the chance to imagine themselves in that situation.

You don't care about anything in JP... What? (You mean JP3 right?)
The fat guard (Nick) clearly didn't do his job, so I wanted to see him bite the dust  Tongue
If you read the book you'd understand Nedry's motivations for his actions. He was bullied and shoved by Hammond, he was forced to work overtime on the computers. Of course anyone would feel resentment and a bit revengeful for that.
And I don't know about you but I never wished for any JP character to die... They were each important/unique in their own way. There's no TRUE evil/bad guy in the JP movies. All of them have motivation and reasoning for their actions.

Yeah. I meant JP3.

And I don't use what happens in the books to explain or give context to the film. They're both their own separate thing. 
And I gotta disagree with you about there being no bad guys in the series. TLW has two of the most one-dimensional baddies one could ask for. The greedy corporate millionaire only motivated by the bottom line and the cruel jerk who hurts animals for fun. Hoskins is also a pure villain. Having motivation and reasoning is what MAKES a villain a villain. 
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#18
(01-09-2017, 12:39 AM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: Yeah. I meant JP3.

And I don't use what happens in the books to explain or give context to the film. They're both their own separate thing. 
And I gotta disagree with you about there being no bad guys in the series. TLW has two of the most one-dimensional baddies one could ask for. The greedy corporate millionaire only motivated by the bottom line and the cruel jerk who hurts animals for fun. Hoskins is also a pure villain. Having motivation and reasoning is what MAKES a villain a villain. 

JP3 is not perfect, but it does get some things right that JW does not.
The books are important though. You can't just ignore the original subject matter IMO. I think Nedry's motivation is clear.

I'll say there aren't any TRUE evil characters in the movie thus far.

Ludlow is attempting to salvage Ingen from total ruin after Hammond's blunder.
Dieter Stark is just your average cocky hunter, wouldn't call him bad.
Hoskins sees the potential in the dinosaurs for more than just money-making applications.

 Their intentions may not be good, but they aren't flat out evil. You just have to put yourself in their shoes.
"It's a high hide. A high hide, you know you go up and you hide high. Goes up to where the trees are, and keeps the researchers out of harms way" - Eddie Carr
'Actually it would put them at a very convenient biting height" - Ian Malcolm
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#19
(01-09-2017, 07:07 AM)Aegyptiacus3 Wrote:
(01-09-2017, 12:39 AM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: Yeah. I meant JP3.

And I don't use what happens in the books to explain or give context to the film. They're both their own separate thing. 
And I gotta disagree with you about there being no bad guys in the series. TLW has two of the most one-dimensional baddies one could ask for. The greedy corporate millionaire only motivated by the bottom line and the cruel jerk who hurts animals for fun. Hoskins is also a pure villain. Having motivation and reasoning is what MAKES a villain a villain. 

JP3 is not perfect, but it does get some things right that JW does not.
The books are important though. You can't just ignore the original subject matter IMO. I think Nedry's motivation is clear.

I'll say there aren't any TRUE evil characters in the movie thus far.

Ludlow is attempting to salvage Ingen from total ruin after Hammond's blunder.
Dieter Stark is just your average cocky hunter, wouldn't call him bad.
Hoskins sees the potential in the dinosaurs for more than just money-making applications.

 Their intentions may not be good, but they aren't flat out evil. You just have to put yourself in their shoes.

I didn't say the books aren't important. I don't use them to explain anything in the films. It's logically flawed.
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#20
(01-10-2017, 08:51 PM)RaptorBlueMalcolm89 Wrote: I didn't say the books aren't important. I don't use them to explain anything in the films. It's logically flawed.

How? The scenario is directly taken from the book. It just provides more detail IMO. This would have been described in the script anyway.
"It's a high hide. A high hide, you know you go up and you hide high. Goes up to where the trees are, and keeps the researchers out of harms way" - Eddie Carr
'Actually it would put them at a very convenient biting height" - Ian Malcolm
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